Curse

Xenex Xclame · Sep 22, 2009, 03:26 AM // 03:26

What stops me personally from GvG'ing?
No GvG guild.

Plain and simple.I used to be in a guild about 2 years ago that GvG'd on a regular occation about 4 days a week.But right about the time GW:EN came out most of us had gotten a bit bored with GW and slowly we started playing less and less.I am currently in a guild with some of the old members of the GvG guild, but they dont log on.So basically its just me

I came back this time about 3 months ago and would like to find a GvG guild,but its kind hard to find one that will actually play a GvG, you might find a guild that says they GvG but when you join them you never get to do a GvG for whatever reason.

From personal experience its also kind of hard to get a GvG guild,I mean theres the searh thing where there is a separete section for guild recruitments and etc, but there is no real place to go and find GvG guilds,if you want to find a HA guild, its easier as you can just go to HA and post that you are searching and just wait and hope.

subarucar · Sep 22, 2009, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocobo1

New Zealand ping means 300-500 lag constantly. So I feel as if there is no point really trying to get into GvG, as even though I understand the game and play well, my timing for stuff like Interupts, Prots and Heals would be off.

I used to play top 400 GvG on 250-400, so its not that bad.
Some time heavy commitments came up and I left for a casual PvE guild so I could do a few farm runs or missions when I have time on. When I had more time availible I tried to get back into GvG, but most of the guilds around were either full, bad or played during hours I couldn't.

Short answer
The main problem of getting into GvG are getting people on at the same time and finding a decent guild.

Zahr Dalsk · Sep 22, 2009, 03:43 AM // 03:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuntharley

See I love how you label GvG as not a game.

Because it isn't; it's not fun, and no one in their right mind would think it is.

GvG is played as a competition, or a sport, not as something fun like a game.

moriz · Sep 22, 2009, 03:47 AM // 03:47

a well played, well executed gvg match is about the most fun i've had while playing GW. so yes, gvg can potentially be VERY fun. by your definition, that makes it a game.

it might not be fun for you, but it is fun for many people. why do you think professional athletes and gamers play the way they do? ultimately it's not about the money. they play because they genuinely love the game.

Zahr Dalsk · Sep 22, 2009, 03:56 AM // 03:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

a well played, well executed gvg match is about the most fun i've had while playing GW

I take it then that you skipped the actual game.

Canon · Sep 22, 2009, 03:56 AM // 03:56

I think I've read all of the replies so far so thanks for giving the feedback. Is there anything a player can do to try and encourage more guilds or people to GvG?

DreamWind · Sep 22, 2009, 03:56 AM // 03:56

GvG is by far the best part about Guild Wars...I have no doubt in my mind about that.

That being said...it simply isn't worth it anymore, and most players who have left will probably agree with me. While there has always been some level of difficulty to get players together to play, back in the older days of GvG it was worth it. The game was awesome. But now there have been far too many hits to the game over the years. Me and every single person I used to know who played GvG with me have 0 desire to ever do it again.

lutz · Sep 22, 2009, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarevok Thordin

Oh yeah, that's another thing, foul play by high lvl GvGers <_<

Let's not forget what happened during that infamous MAT with Rawr...

It's not really foul play as much as it is the poor system implemented by ArenaNet. If you have around 1500 rating you'll never get a match on ladder - you'll literally be waiting in the queue for 30 minutes - 1 hour at a time for a 3 minute match.

moriz · Sep 22, 2009, 03:59 AM // 03:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

I take it then that you skipped the actual game.

well, considering that gvg was once considered the ultimate endgame of GW, then no, i have not skipped the actual game.

but no, i have done just about every part of GW. outside of one or two elite areas, i've done everything GW has to offer. my statement still stands: a well played, well executed gvg match is the most fun i've had in GW... in any game, for that matter.

i don't know why it's such a chore for you, but for many of us, it isn't.

Darth The Xx · Sep 22, 2009, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

I take it then that you skipped the actual game.

Sorry but from my viewpoint people who PvE are "skipping the actual game". Why? because it takes far less skill to beat a computer than an actual person.

On that note I don't GvG anymore cus my times suck, i'm in NZ and my play times result in 30 min+ waits for 1 game, which most definitely is NOT fun!

Jensy · Sep 22, 2009, 04:31 AM // 04:31

As to what can be done, I don't know. It's not always apparent that the GvG community *wants* new players around. You're either PvP (GvG), or you're a whiny PvE noob. Now, granted this is because a lot of the discussion here on guru is of the "ZOMG LEAVE PVE ALONE!" crowd who whine, and cry, and whine when something gets nerfed in PvE. Like, yanno, this past week for example *g*

So when you've got players that do want to participate in discussions... we all get lumped with the whiners. and get a "stfu and go back to pve, noob!" or witty comments/injokes from the usual crowd. It's hard to break into that, and/or come right out and say look, I don't understand why X, Y, Z were nerfed, can someone explain? Not that discussions = GvG, but since a lot of the higher end GvG crowd comments here, if a newer pvp player is constantly being excluded and told to GTFO, well, they'll just GTFO :P

We're admittedly PvP fangirls in my guild. And by that I mean, we watch obs, we sit and discuss obs, we have mAT watching parties in the guild hall. We're *dorks* of the highest order. We got tired of watching, and are going to play.

QueenofDeath · Sep 22, 2009, 04:45 AM // 04:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

the sheer logistical nightmare of getting:

-8 people from different part of the world
-getting those people to log on at the same time, consistently
-finding people that are likeminded, and similarly skilled
-and last of all, having those 8 people actually like each other

are the main deterrent of getting more people into gvg. it's the nature of the beast: the problem is the format itself.

I agree with this as well. If they would make a random GVG type arena play I'd play in that a lot. But, choose up GVG there's too much leetism and arrogant players in the game for that to interest me and many others. I'd like to play on the GVG maps, but, not as a formed guild. Just formed random players who want to have fun and aren't so focused on have to win all the time or you suk.

I'll bet you there are more players playing RA, FA, JQ and AB combined than there are playing GVG. Granted AB is choose up but players are less arrogant in AB and less leet acting than GVG players. When I was a member of a GVG team it was very much having 8 players who could get along with each other. I never saw such a blame game as I did playing GVG. It's your fault nooo it was the monks fault, noooo it was the rangers or the mesmers or anybody but YOU's fault. lol

Quote:

Why? because it takes far less skill to beat a computer than an actual person.

See it's people who make statements like that that are the reason many don't play GVG or any form of PVP. He has no clue what he's talking about because his statement is subjective. I've faced many in PVP who didn't have the skill of a noob area AI. I

t can take far more skill to be able to figure out the build to beat many of the ai bosses in the game. You just don't go in with a blanket skill build and beat the AI unless you've copied something from wiki or someone told you a build.

PVP is a learning process just like playing the PVE game and I've met many a PVP player who had less skills than the AI in many areas of the map. Everything is built around mathematics and timing and the AI can do that very well. The human element just has the ability to eventually outthink the ai code, but, not always the first try same with a new PVP player. There are some PVP players who never gain the skill to even be fair in the game. Some people are just stupid like that. Just like saying it takes far less skill to defeat a computer ai than it does an actual person.

moriz · Sep 22, 2009, 05:22 AM // 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by QueenofDeath

See it's people who make statements like that that are the reason many don't play GVG or any form of PVP. He has no clue what he's talking about because his statement is subjective. I've faced many in PVP who didn't have the skill of a noob area AI. I

t can take far more skill to be able to figure out the build to beat many of the ai bosses in the game. You just don't go in with a blanket skill build and beat the AI unless you've copied something from wiki or someone told you a build.

PVP is a learning process just like playing the PVE game and I've met many a PVP player who had less skills than the AI in many areas of the map. Everything is built around mathematics and timing and the AI can do that very well. The human element just has the ability to eventually outthink the ai code, but, not always the first try same with a new PVP player. There are some PVP players who never gain the skill to even be fair in the game. Some people are just stupid like that. Just like saying it takes far less skill to defeat a computer ai than it does an actual person.

errr... i recently blasted my way though pve with an entirely self-made build (including hero builds). it was a mesmer to boot. with four interrupts. it uses psychic instability as its elite. i was purposely trying to give myself a challenge.

way prior to that, back in early '06 when i first picked up the game, i quite accidentally stumbled into RA... and didn't leave until Factions came out. when i did play pve again, i was awestruck as to how easy it was. vizunah square? masters on the first try. thunderhead keep? took a long time, but did it easily. pve in its entirety was of absolutely no challenge to me, even before PvE skills and heroes.

did my time spent in RA simply made me a better player? i don't know. i do know that, if RA has a difficulty of 5 out of 10, general PvE would be a 2. it conditioned me to be far faster and far more precise in my execution than what's needed for PvE, and i think that's what made it so easy for me.

honestly though, i don't see how it's even comparable to compare PvE to any level of PvP. they are effectively separate games. the people you've found to epicfail in PvE probably do in PvP also. unless you've found yourself true retards, i find it hard to imagine any competent PvP'er to fail in PvE.

Catchphrase · Sep 22, 2009, 05:50 AM // 05:50

If I want some thrills, I would DotA, at least it doesn't require a full team to start a match and it is much more popular here in where I lived than GW, making me feel more at ease. GW is just something I would play when I want to have my own private moment.

Darth The Xx · Sep 22, 2009, 05:57 AM // 05:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

errr... i recently blasted my way though pve with an entirely self-made build (including hero builds). it was a mesmer to boot. with four interrupts. it uses psychic instability as its elite. i was purposely trying to give myself a challenge.

way prior to that, back in early '06 when i first picked up the game, i quite accidentally stumbled into RA... and didn't leave until Factions came out. when i did play pve again, i was awestruck as to how easy it was. vizunah square? masters on the first try. thunderhead keep? took a long time, but did it easily. pve in its entirety was of absolutely no challenge to me, even before PvE skills and heroes.

did my time spent in RA simply made me a better player? i don't know. i do know that, if RA has a difficulty of 5 out of 10, general PvE would be a 2. it conditioned me to be far faster and far more precise in my execution than what's needed for PvE, and i think that's what made it so easy for me.

honestly though, i don't see how it's even comparable to compare PvE to any level of PvP. they are effectively separate games. the people you've found to epicfail in PvE probably do in PvP also. unless you've found yourself true retards, i find it hard to imagine any competent PvP'er to fail in PvE.

Following on from this its almost like a food chain but certain areas jst require you to be better. For example I started out in PvE like most ppl in the game, then after about a week did RA/AB and stuff and found PvE extraodinarily easy. That being said, after I picked up GvG and went back to TA/RA/AB I also found it extremely easy so this is in no way exclusive to PvE, just for me personally PvE is the bottom of the food chain. Strike that JQ and FA are below PvE IMO

DreamWind · Sep 22, 2009, 06:22 AM // 06:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darth The Xx

Following on from this its almost like a food chain but certain areas jst require you to be better. For example I started out in PvE like most ppl in the game, then after about a week did RA/AB and stuff and found PvE extraodinarily easy. That being said, after I picked up GvG and went back to TA/RA/AB I also found it extremely easy so this is in no way exclusive to PvE, just for me personally PvE is the bottom of the food chain. Strike that JQ and FA are below PvE IMO

I feel the exact same way. I used to be a hardcore PvE player, then I slowly discovered PvP and it was like my eyes were opened. Then I discovered GvG and realized I could never go back because I found what made Guild Wars better than other games. Everything less is either a grind or done better in other games.

I would still be playing GvG today if not for all the horrific changes Anet made to the game. I think any bad change that is made is amplified in this game, because if any of the people you play with quit, it hurts you as well because that is another person you have to find who can play. The PvP community has took serious hits, and when a community takes hits like that in any game, it is nearly impossible to rebuild.

Sarevok Thordin · Sep 22, 2009, 06:33 AM // 06:33

I think alot of the PvP community took a hit when lots of the koreans left the game because there were no more money making tournaments.

Artisan Archer · Sep 22, 2009, 06:47 AM // 06:47

I've been one of those players that actually followed the;
PvE -> RA -> TA -> HA-> GvG line

First completing all campaigns, get almost all skills for my ranger. Then playing RA to get basic knowledge of PvP (even if it's typed in caps and followed by XXX has left the game.) Then wanting more of a coordinated format, moving to TA. Actually building a friendlist there, people asked me to come to HA. I HA'd for a very short while. I like the 8v8 format, but I just didn't like the fact that I rarely got to wield a bow as a ranger (aka, gimmick builds). In the mean I did do GvG with some of my guilds before, but they tend to disband rather quick. Then I searched a GvG guild here on gwguru and I must say it's the most fun I've ever had playing Guild Wars. I was very lucky to find a guild that actually had experienced members, who just restarting GvGing.

If I look at my personal experience, this is why few people are GvGing;

- Some people never make it past RA.
- Some people are happy with HA and don't want to GvG.
- Many people don't want to leave everything to join a GvG guild.
- Many people quit after the initial (and inevitable) losses.

The only people that remain, are either part of a huge guilds/alliance that casually GvG's(few and far between), or part of a GvG-only guild.

M @ T · Sep 22, 2009, 07:07 AM // 07:07

Basically what everybody said above and also the horrific lag. I GvGed in 5 matches yesterday and got error 007 on 4 and I wasn't the only one. Many players have connection issues.

I still try to GvG, I'm not much into PvE or HA(I practically stoped playing HA when the 1st IWay hit the scene)but now I'm starting HAing too.

Milia Ameliorate · Sep 22, 2009, 07:31 AM // 07:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by pansy malfoy

Actually, my guild is planning to get into GvG within the next two months. What's been holding us back is:

1) Scheduling. We've got players from all over the world, and getting a few hours where someone isn't at work/school/asleep, and then finding 8 of them to gather in one spot... eesh. Our "core" so to speak, is a 50/50 American/Euro split :P

Currently sitting on a guild of 5-6 members who play regularly and are looking for more consistent GvGs, or guesting possibilites at the least. If you are looking for scrim partners of equal nubness, or potential guildies/guests feel free to friend me on Milia Ameliorate and give us a shout! We haven't GvG'ed in ages, and we're still really pretty new- still finding roles we like, working tactics, etc! Would be awesome to have more people around to communicate and improve with. We ran a guild rating into the ground to the point where Late Night Byob was one of the few guilds lower on the totem pole <3 still funny to lose to them and see gold trim guesting on a 2k+ rank guild.

As to the thread at hand, I know the two big hurdles we've faced/are facing currently- 1 the difficulty of getting a core 8 and making it stick, and 2 just figuring out what works and what doesn't ;/ Thrown out several different types of builds from a cleanspike attempt as our very first build (lol) to a pressureish/split setup later on.